At the dawn of a very exciting second part of the season for both club and national team, Castello Lukeba spoke at length to tell us about his new life: the C1, Germany and its blue horizon.
His sensational entry into the French football landscape, less than three years ago, quickly established his potential. From the top of his 21 springs, Castello Lukeba almost naturally embodies the next generation of French football in a position where the talent pool is exceptional. Elegant and imposing, clairvoyant on the green rectangle, the neo-Blue stands out with its discretion and simplicity outside. His speech, composed and lucid, is of an accuracy which speaks volumes of his maturity. Interview.
Castello, you are going through a very rich period: new club, new responsibilities in Espoirs, discovery of the A. How did you experience this accelerated learning ?
It’s true that it happened quite quickly. When I made the decision to leave Lyon, it was to have this kind of experience, to grow as a footballer and as a man. I was lucky that things went well immediately upon my arrival. I was able to play one match after another and adapt. There is no reason to get excited or upset. We know that in football things move quickly, in both directions. We can ride you or we can take you down very quickly. You have to stay yourself. That’s why I’m here today.
You were summoned for the first time by Didier Deschamps. Is this the strongest moment of your young career?
I had never experienced such a powerful moment. The French team, everyone dreams of it. We’ve been watching it on TV since we were little. Especially since I wasn’t expecting it at all. I was thinking of doing my U21 rally and finally, at the end of training, I was told that I was going to join them. I didn’t believe it, I thought it was a joke or something unexpected, that I wasn’t going to join them. And finally, go there with Malo (Gusto, editor’s note), my friend, it was an even stronger feeling.
You were at Clairefontaine with the Espoirs and you joined the other building. How did the A’s welcome you? It’s quite atypical, as an entry into Blue!
They made me feel very, very welcome. I was one of the youngest so obviously I was a little shy, in the background, I observed. But the reception went very well. They gave us a lot of advice. We didn’t feel left out at all.
“I think I made the right choice”
What is your relationship with Thierry Henry and Didier Deschamps?
I know my Espoirs coach, Thierry Henry, a little better because I spent more time with him but they have a lot in common, particularly in player management. They communicate a lot with the players. They talk a lot about their experience. They are also very flirtatious, very teasing. They were world champions. When they talk, you listen to what they say.
You were named captain of the Espoirs by Thierry Henry. It flattered you that he recognized your leadership qualities ?
Of course, that flattered me. Plus, I’m one of the old guys. I’ve been in Espoirs for a while now so I must have this leadership role. I’m very happy that he recognizes it. It’s up to me to give him back that trust.
Last summer, you signed for a club renowned for its ability to develop young players with high potential. Was that the determining criterion for you?
Let’s say that it was part of the criteria, but it was not the determining criterion. When we see the players who have passed through the club, they are all now in very big clubs. There is also the fact that the club plays in the Champions League. I think it was an important step in my career to play there after having experienced the Europa League. I think I really made the right choice.
We can’t help but think of players who play in your position and who exploded at the international level in Leipzig: following in the footsteps of Dayot Upamecano or Ibrahima Konaté is a dream trajectory…
These are examples, that’s clear. They didn’t skip any steps, they were never in a hurry. And when we see where they are now, in the French team, in top clubs. When you see that, you say to yourself that this could be the example to follow.
TWere you able to discuss it with Ibrahima Konaté during the A gathering?
Yes, I talked about it a little with him. We talked about everything. He gave me a lot of advice, a bit like a big brother. He also passed through Leipzig, he was in the situation I am in so he did not hesitate to give me advice for later.
“With the other defenders, we have this mentality of wanting to pull each other up”
We have the feeling that despite the enormous competition for this position in French football, there is great complicity between you all. Can you tell us a little about the relationships you had with the other defenders?
It is clear that in this position, France has a huge pool, whether among the A, the Espoirs or even with other players who have not yet been selected. So already, there is this mark of respect. We know everyone’s level. And then, the competition is healthy because we know very well how things happen in football. There is no point in envying or being jealous. When one plays, we wish him the best. The important thing in each match is to move the team forward. I think we all have this mentality. We are all young, ambitious. We all want to pull ourselves up.
Let’s go back to your first part of the club season: there was a pivotal moment when you faced Bayern Munich in quick succession – against whom you scored your first goal – then Manchester City. Measuring yourself against world references like Harry Kane or Erling Haaland, you took this as a first turning point in your new life ?
I wanted to play in the Champions League. This means playing against the best. I had prepared myself to play against any great striker so it’s true that facing Harry Kane or Erling Haaland were good tests for me. This allowed me to see the very high level. Afterwards, in France too, I had the chance to face Paris Saint-Germain who had names like Kylian Mbappé, Lionel Messi or Neymar. So I had already met these types of great players.
You will continue this campaign with a double confrontation against Real Madrid. How are you approaching this meeting?
With a lot of excitement. We are competitors. As footballers, we dream of playing this type of match. Real Madrid are gala matches, matches that make you dream. But then we still have to remain competitive and want to win the match, not just compete. It won’t be easy but I think we have arguments to thwart them, and maybe even a little more than that…
More generally, how is your integration going in Germany?
It’s true that at the beginning, I was a little apprehensive because it’s the first time I’ve changed clubs, that I’ve left my country. We’re still a little apprehensive to see how it will go. In the end, it went very, very well. The club puts a lot of people around us so that we don’t feel alone. And then I’m in a really incredible group. They immediately put me at ease. There are quite a few French speakers, notably Mohamed Simakan who I knew in Espoirs. He also made my arrival easier.
“By leaving France, I left my comfort zone”
From a technical point of view, what struck you about the Bundesliga?
The intensity there is, it’s incredible! All teams attack and defend together. This is why there are so many goals and spectacle in many matches. In France, we sometimes say that we are in a bit of an observation round, more cautious. In Germany, it’s true that there isn’t that side at all. Even a team that loses 2-0, 3-0, will want to continue to attack. All matches are difficult and interesting.
You have explained in the past that you were sometimes told that you were ‘too nice’ in your game. As a central defender, do you feel that this intensity allows you to take a step forward compared to the more relaxed pace? of Ligue 1?
Yes, of course, because by leaving France, I’m already stepping out of my comfort zone a little. There are things I need to improve on. Most attackers in the Bundesliga are a bit like hungry dogs, they like to harass the defender constantly, relentlessly. I can’t afford to play easy, to be too nice. I have to respond to the duel because otherwise I’ll get eaten. It’s true that this takes me a step further. I am very happy to learn another football culture. A culture different from that of France.
With these unbridled matches, a defender has more depth to manage behind his back. In the management of space and time, there too do you feel that you have progressed?
Yes, especially with the coach we have (Marco Rose, editor’s note). He asks us to play very high so we leave a lot of space behind us. Afterwards, I had already had the chance to have coaches who asked the same thing so I am not totally disoriented. We run a lot. This allows me to further expand my tactical palette.
Are there any players who inspired you in this style when you were younger?
I really liked watching FC Barcelona, so the player that stood out for me was Carles Puyol. I really liked his activity, his leadership.
And in the current players ?
Thiago Silva and Sergio Ramos, who for me are absolute references to this central defender position. But then, the one I necessarily identify with is Samuel Umtiti, because people have been making this comparison to me since I was little. And then David Alaba too. These are players that I watch a lot.
“As Lyonnais, we have this pride”
You are passionate and a perfectionist, how does this translate? Do you watch videos?
I think my perfectionist side is thanks to my mom who always told me: ‘you can do better’ (laughter). Even when I had good matches, she kept telling me: ‘you can do better, you can do better’. So let’s say that I am eternally dissatisfied (laughter). I always want to do better, to progress. After the matches, the first thing I do is review my performance on video, what I did well but also what I did less well. Ever since I was little, I’ve always done that. Even when I wasn’t on TV, I was lucky enough to have parents who were filming so I asked for the video directly so I could correct myself. Since I was little, I have always had this approach of wanting to improve myself. I think that’s what conditions me.
You were talking earlier about your selection in A with Malo Gusto. There is a large group of players from the Lyon academy, also in Espoirs. Did this unite you even more? With Bradley Barcola, Malo Gusto and the other Lyonnais still present at OL like Maxence Caqueret, you maintain a strong bond despite the paths which separate at club ?
Yes of course. We grew up seeing Nabil Fekir, Corentin Tolisso, Samuel Umtiti become world champions coming from Lyon, so it’s as if we had been world champions with them. We, as Lyonnais, have this pride, we claim that, often. When we talk about it, we are very happy to see each other again. And we hope to be able to play at a very high level together – or against each other, which will mean that we have all succeeded, in quotes. It’s true that we talk about it from time to time. This is important to us.
You are in an “airlock” between the Blues and the Espoirs. How are you approaching this year 2024 with the Euro and the Olympics, knowing that you have got a head in the A?
It’s certain that when you taste the A’s, you want to return there as often as possible. Afterwards, there are big deadlines coming up, whether it is the Euro or the Olympics. For me, these are two very important deadlines. I don’t place one above the other. For me, representing your country is an honor, a pride. Me, as a competitor, I would say that I would like to play both competitions but after that it doesn’t just depend on me. Saying it is good, but it’s my performances that will do everything. I don’t worry more than anything else. I’m trying to perform well with my club, and we’ll see what happens this summer.
Comments collected by Jean-Charles Danrée
